NORC Advisory Meeting Notes Teleconference call held on January 11, 2008
In attendance:
| Attendees | Representing |
|---|---|
| Mary Kanerva | Aging & Adult Service, Catholic Family Center |
| Eileen Mullarkey | Long Term Care, Dept. for the Aging, NYC |
| Fredda Vladeck | Aging in Place Initiative, United Hospital Fund |
| Anita Altman | Gov't and External Affairs, UJA Federation of NY, Inc. |
| Joseph Cybulski | Rensselaer Unified Family Services Dept. of Aging |
| Ronald Soloway | Gov't and External Relations, UJA- Federation of NY, Inc. |
| Ken Harris | NYAHSA Ctr for Senior Living and Community Services |
| John Krout, PhD | Dir. Gerontology Inst. and Prof. of Gerontology, Ithaca College |
| Joseph Pofit | Long Term Care Campuses and Senior Housing, Roman Catholic Diocese of Albany |
| Rick Iannello | Albany Guardian Society |
| Robert Leavitt | Resident of Fairport Baptist NNORC |
| Anschel Weiss, PhD | Consultant/ Resident of the JFS NENY Neighborhood NORC |
| Michael J. Burgess | NYSOFA |
| Cyndy Marshall | NYSOFA |
| Gail Myers | NYSOFA |
| Larry Shapiro | NYSOFA |
| Tim Kovarik | NYSOFA |
| Eileen Griffin | NYSOFA |
| Ellen O'Connor | Director of the Fairport Baptist NNORC- ( provides comment) |
| Natalie Gordon | Member of AARP National Policy Council and AARP Board of Directors |
| Absent from the call: | |
| Marianne Fahs | Brookdale Center for Healthy Aging and Longevity |
| Evelyn (Evie) Rich | NYC Chapter of Americans for Democratic Action, Member of NYC NORC Coalition |
| Stephanie Pinder | Lincoln Square Neighborhood Center, Inc. |
| Annie Hines | Resident at Lincoln Square Neighborhood Center NORC |
| Edward Woda | Legislative Coordinator, Comm. on Aging, NYS Assembly |
| Jennifer Best | Legislative Analyst, Committee on Aging, NYS Assembly |
1.) John Krout, PhD- provided an overview of the issues in NYS rural counties as they pertain to NNORCs.
Background of rural counties in NYS:
- 43 counties in the state are rural, living there are 450,000 individuals who are 65 + (or 13.7%) of the population. Higher than most states.
- Factors that effect this is the out- migration of younger residents, and the in-migration of elderly residents.
- Rural areas have a high median age and lower population growth, with lower population growth.
- Rural areas also have a lower household income for all age groups.
- Rural areas have a lower percentage of physicians, and overall less access to physical and mental health services.
- Some stereotypes surrounding rural communities-like rural places are healthier places to
live, that the people in these areas are healthier and more self-sufficient.
Also, many believe that one rural area is the same as another. - Actual facts are that rural areas are all diverse, and many areas do not fit the "usual" -like Putnam Co., and counties that have military bases. Rural areas lack much access to health and nutrition care, including limited number of nursing home options. Also, there are environmental health issues that arise from people having worked for years in agriculture. A key point is that rural areas lack transportation options.
- Housing issues are prevalent in rural areas and it is difficult to find developers. Local officials are aware of these challenges.
Rural Communities/NORCs
- John mentioned that in reference to the NORC guidelines that rural counties would not meet the standard definition and would have great difficulty obtaining matching funds. He also stated that rural areas may lack the skilled personnel (grant writers) to pursue obtaining administrative funds.
- Ancshel Weiss stated that rural areas have difficulty to qualify as for NORC services due to low population density.
- Fredda Vladeck provided comment that in review of NORC legislation, and the guidelines of the NYSOFA match policy she feels it is necessary to revisit the document for review since it is not clear what the policy is accomplishing, and if it truly reflects resources that are available in the community. Fredda also stated that not all cities or urban communities are alike either and that the NORC model does not speak to ever situation. She raised the question of what are the elements that make a rural community and how can they fit the NORC model.
- John commented that the possible solution would be bridge more rural communities together to qualify them as a NORC, yet this could not be the entire county. Natalie Gordon suggested finding a community and listing the resources to determine if this idea is feasible.
2.) Proposed Legislative Changes
Proposed Revisions to the Classic NORC Legislation Language and the marked up version of Elder Law 209. Gail Myers noted that no voting on drafted items can officially be done until everyone on the Council is confirmed by the Governor's office. No one has reached confirmation yet, but consensus can be determined. Gail also offered explanation about the process of how bills are reviewed by the legislature.
Proposal: Delete housing "built with government assistance", since the income limitation is already made clear by utilizing the HUD guidelines. Ron Salloway, Anita Altman, and Fredda Vladeck lead this discussion that government supported language is no longer needed since NORCs need to meet the HUD guidelines. The original legislation was written at a time when census income data was not as easily available. Ron described this as a "clean up" item, and stated that this was proposed on a bill, along with other items, last year but the bill was not passed. Gail Myers pointed out that Elder Law 209, section 5 ensures this- a majority of the elderly to be served are low or moderate income, as defined by the United states Department of Housing and Urban Development.
Rick Iannello asked if upper middle class communities were to ask for assistance to organize themselves as a NORC would NYSOFA provide it. Mike Burgess confirmed that the office would and that this subject and related issues will need to be discussed in future Council meetings since there may be demonstration projects of grant funds (60k) to be offered to communities who wish to organize to be like a NORC. The United Hospital Fund will also be launching the "NORC Blueprint" on their website in February and it will demonstrate best practices for beginning and operating a NORC. Ken Harris asked if communities that are organizing to "age in place" can use the NORC title. The answer was provided that it can be used since it is not a "protected tile". Discussion took place that there is not national standards for NORCs. Fredda stated that she will provide the Council with AoA language from the original NORC demonstration projects.
Council Action: consensus was determined and all callers from the Council were in agreement to delete "built with government assistance".
Proposal: Delete "head of household" for the population count.
The original legislation set the criteria for NORCs to be 50% of heads of households needs to be seniors. This eliminates many households since many elderly are residing with children, and are raising grandchildren but may not be the head of household. 50% is difficult for rural areas.
Council Action: Consensus in support of this proposal was reached.
Proposal: Reduce the population threshold level from 50% to 40% of residents who are at least 60 years old with a minimum of 250 senior residents or a community with a minimum of 500 seniors (reduced from 2,500)
Fredda mentioned that in 1999 New York City added a minimum count and that maybe the State needs to do this. Many factors effect these percentages such as patterns of housing settlements, (like in NYC with high percentages of seniors), and upstate with more of a geographic spread. A question was asked about a typical apartment building size in upstate, and the comment was there is no typical size. The right level of density in NORCS was discussed. Ken Harris raised the concern that if lowered to 40% and a minimum of 250 residents would be difficult for upstate to have. Discussion took place about the "economy of scale" and for example what is the right economy of scale to serve 30 people with a $150,000 dollar grant? Is there community development, or is the need just providing services? Fredda commented that if the density numbers were lowered NYSOFA could be flooded with applications from NYC. Gail Myers suggested that legislation could be drafted for percentage numbers for rural and urban (NYC) areas to be different and appropriate for that population density.
Council Action: A subcommittee of members will be formed to further clarify this proposal.
The members of the subcommittee will be:
- John Krout
- Joe Profit
- Fredda Vladeck
- Ken Harris
- Rick Iannello
- Anita Altman
- Mary Kanerva
The subcommittee conference call will be January 30th from 1:00-2:30pm.
The next full NORC Advisory Council Meeting (via conference call) is scheduled for February 7th @ 2:00pm.
Call-in information for both conference calls will following in an e-mail.
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